Been a long time listener to FDR, although I’ve always been more of a lurker
than anything else. I've been toying with the idea of DeFoOing ever since I
began listening to FDR, but didn't really feel like I had the right to post on
the board until I’ve tried some of the "jujitsu" moves. I've listened
through most of the relationship/psychology podcasts, listened/read the free
books, and am now working on the ask a therapist ones, Much of the stored
repertoire of stef's arguments were really useful when finally debating with my
parents yesterday.
Before you look at the wall of text below, Feel free to jump to the bottom. The middle is just me providing history and background and details of the family discussion.
My key difficulty is: I've seemed
to have dug myself too deep into DeFoOing, and I feel that it is pre-mature. I
am not quite ready to really DeFoO because I am not financially dependant yet.
Violence does not occur regularly, although it is still very vivid when it
does. I was caught up in the moment and expressed my logic and jumped to
conclusions too fast. And I'm a little anxious now.
TL;DR: Had a huge argument with dad, employed some FDR Logic, and worried that i've gone too far to turn back.
============= WARNING, gets loooooong and detailed starting here, family history and details of argument below =============================================
Background wise, I'm ethnically Chinese, I have an older brother, and I’m
from Hong Kong, My parents fit the typical Chinese
parent stereotype, but are less demanding about grades than others are. I'll be
entering 3rd year of college come autumn, and have been battling with the whole
procrastination/purpose of life puzzle for as long as I can remember. My family
is fortunately financially stable.
My biggest problem with my dad is that he does not listen, accept, or
validate what I say. In fact he shoots it down often and calls me a spoiled
brat. That hurts a lot, because I do not think I am ungrateful for what he has
provided. He often makes a big deal of not turning off the lights or eating
vitamins, and always begins arguments by raising his voice and screaming at me
until I submit to his position. When I do not submit, this has often escalated
into violence and he has hit me, although he claims to not remember. This has
been going on for a very long time. He does not talk, he lectures. And the
typical dinner conversation is just me grunting and making agreeing sounds
periodically at what my dad says. Of course, mom is always in the background
during all this, and truly it is very difficult for me to put her in the same
category as my dad. But under the close scrutiny of being an "enabler"
and never really defending me when my dad "disciplines" me (except
one time when he choked me), I really cannot logically find an excuse for her, even
though at this point in time I cannot bring myself to hate her.
Of course, my dad also has his nicer moments, I don't want to sound
unrealistic and paint him as the devil. Outside of the deeper conversations
that actually matter, (family issues, personal philosophy), when he socializes
with other ppl, he comes across as an intellectual, extroverted and friendly
man. If I met him on the street, I’d have no problem with him, because he acts
completely differently with other people than at home.
Having landed on FDR and learned the RTR techniques, I finally practiced
them today when my dad bellowed yet again at my older brother when he forgot to
eat one of the many vitamins. It just so happens that this is the recurring
issue for him because the rest of the family does not consider vitamins a big
deal. And since he yells and blasts his rage at us for not eating it, nobody
really wants to eats it voluntarily. I was painfully vulnerable today, and
repeatedly had my feelings shot down, but I stuck to RTR and worded out my
feelings whenever things were about to escalate. When I tell him I do not like
to eat the vitamins because it reminds me of all the previous arguments over
the vitamins, my father sees that as me blaming him and pushing responsibility
at him. Even though I’ve repeatedly explained that he is not responsible for
what I feel. This is an area where he cannot get over, and the rest of the
conversation was severely hindered by him always returning to saying that I’m
blaming him for not eating my vitamins, for not doing what is expected of me.
He keeps saying that it’s just a simple matter, and that he is already
expecting very little of me. I keep trying to move him away from the vitamins,
and onto how he treats people, but he keeps changing the topic back. I am very
-ing frustrated about this, and it took me a good hour and a half before I
could squeeze out an apology from him for having hit me for trivial things in
the past. I needed the apology for closure.
As predicted, my mother and brother were both supporting me as this was
going along, occasionally coming in to speak when I ran out of words. But when I
shined the spotlight on how his treatment of me is abusive and evil, instantly
my mother and brother started attacking me. I reasoned that if he finds nothing
wrong with violence as a "disciplining" tool, and continues to
disregard or dismiss what I have said before, then we have fundamentally
different values, and I cannot live with someone who has fundamentally
different values. Here, my mom chimed in and said that’s not true, because she
is doing it right now. Obviously, she has no other choice, but I did not point
that out at that time, because I really did value her as an initial ally. And I’m
not quite ready to go all the way. Interestingly enough, my dad did point out
that I have the choice to leave, but when I questioned him if he was indirectly
disowning me by saying that, he clamed shut and eventually forced a change in
topic.
========== Below is where I actually get to the point ===================
What I’m questioning now, is that maybe I’ve expressed my idea to DeFoO too
soon. I don’t actually plan on doing it till I graduate from college and secure
a job. My dad had yelled at my brother for not eating his vitamins today, and I
was going to ignore that outburst until he yelled at me when I had ALREADY
eaten it like a "good obedient son". That burst my bubble of cool and
launched me into it all with the full knowledge of what I’ve learned and come
to realize ever since listening to FDR. It was rather sudden. So I kind of
plunged myself into the first step of DeFoOing by being vulnerable and open.
Although now in retrospect I wonder if I might have messed that up because I
ended up doing a lot of lecturing and drawing up long winded metaphors. (gosh
didn't realize how contagious those are)
Now I’m just wondering if I need to back down (out of self
interest/preservation) and apologize to my mother or something, cause she's
obviously got her feathers ruffled because she thinks I rocked the boat a
little too hard when I talked about dad as an abuser. and she says that I’m too
extreme. My brother is of course siding with her. Funny thing is, I’m usually
very passive and neutral towards other things.
Sorry for the huge wall of text, and thank you for all the podcasts stef, despite
it all, I feel a lot better having gone over that with my family. The issue was
ultimately not resolved, because my dad ran away to go to bed, and my mom surrendered
due to mental exhaustion (and probably to privately talk with him). What I do
fear now is that I’m going to be responsible for bringing it up again, to
continue the conversation of why my dad absolutely sucks at listening to other
people. I really don’t want to get into his family history, but I’m pretty sure
that’s the reason for why he’s doing what he’s doing, but I don’t have enough
proof.
I'd appreciate any reply, and a huge thanks to all the FDR residents